Make your own free website on Tripod.com

Christianity Under Fire

Warning Signs of Dispensationalism?
Home
Study In Acts
Jesus In Genesis
Behemoth, Leviathan And Dragons, Oh My!
The Foolish Man's Guide To Confounding The Wise
A Defense of Individual Election unto Salvation & Critique of Absolute Corporate Election?
Group Think Or Whosoever Will Pt. 3
Paul's Purpose At Athens: Becoming All Things To All People
Personhood And Free Will
Scriptures Calvinist's Misinterpret
Resistance Is Futile!
You're a Hopeless Replacement Theologian If You:
Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth
You Know You're a Preterist if: Part 2
Are You Thankful For What You Have?
Top Ten Signs You Are a Fundamentalist Christian?
Getting Involved With Coffeehouse Ministry
A Few of My Projects
Next Subject
A Year in the Life
Maxwell's Musings
Is the Church, 'The Elect'?
Pope Apologizes For Telling the Truth
Catholic Catechism Paves the Way For Evolution
You Are A Hopeless Liberal If You:
Clean Slate
Three Column Chart
Ultra Dispensationalism: Scriptural or Not?
Group Think or Whosoever Will?
Chronological Chart of New Testament
You Might Be A Closet Dispie If:
Body of Christ versus Israel
The Mark of the Beast: Is it Literal?
You Know You're A Preterist If:
You Know You're a Preterist if: Part Three
The Comings of Christ: The How, When and Where
Groupthink and Cliques in the Church
Focus on the Family or on God
Cult Aware
Open Door Fellowship OR Come As We Are Ministries?
Transubstantiation or Unsubstantiated: If The Plain Sense Makes Sense...
DaVinci Code: Was Christ's Divinity and the Bible invented at the Council of Nicea?
Plain Sense Interpretation/P'shat: Christs Comings
Isaiah 53: Human Sacrifice?
Isaiah 53: Christ Has Risen!!
Who Hath Believed Our Report?
Isaiah 53: Christ Our Passover Lamb
Isaiah 53: Messianic Prophecies Refuted?
Chart comparing Israel to Messiah
Isaiah 53: The Suffering Messiah
Bible Chart: Does the Bible conflict on Salvation Messages?
Christs Coming and Time Gaps
Got Charts!
Are There Two Programs?
When Did the Church Begin?
When Did the Church Begin Pt. 2
Is America Cursed?
How and Why Christianity is Under Fire
Was Mary a Perpetual Virgin?
.
Tribulation or Jacob's Trouble?
Jewish Wannabes and the Holidays
Christmas Under Fire: When Christians Attack
Is Celebrating Christmas Scriptural?
Was Iraq a Just War?
Category 7: The End of the World
If It Believes, Then Waddles and Quacks like a Christian it is a....
Why Homosexuality Should Be Confronted and Exposed
The Doctrine Of Eternal Security-Can You Lose Your Salvation?
Does the Soul Sleep?
Did Jews Kill Jesus?...Hear What Some Jews Have to Say
Some Unscriptural Teachings of the Catholic Church
Arguments That Catholics Use
Pantribulationism: Are There Two Programs Going On?
Before and After
Pantribulationism: What A Day That Will Be!!!!
Definite Article Theology: The Way
Pantribulationism: Extrabiblical Nonsense
My Old Ship, the USS Shreveport Assisting Hurricane Victims
Pantribulationism: Should I Stay or Should I Go?
Trinity of God and Trichotomy of man: Definite Article Theology
Definite Article Theology
Pantribulationism: Blessed Hope and Glorious Appearing
Pantribulationism: The Departure
Pantribulationism: It will all pan out in the end
Straining Out Gnats, Majoring on the Minors
Jewish Wannabes and Eschaholics
When Jewish Wannabes Attack What They Don't Understand
How Jewish Wannabes Attack and How to Identify Them
Historical Method and Homosexuality
If the Plain Sense Makes Sense: Christ's Coming
If the Plain Sense Makes Sense: Evolution
The Silliness of Jack Chick
Inspirational and Patriotic Songs
Communism and Islam -vs- the Faith of America's Founding Fathers
Bridging the Generation Gap
Wrongly Dividing the Word of Truth
Let's Worship the Lord
Faith Under Fire Television Show and Website
Faith Under Fire/Do We Worship the Same God?
Arrogant or Convinced?
Warning Signs of Dispensationalism?
Good News: How To Fight Terrorism
Prophecies Yet To Be Fulfilled: Zechariah 12:10-14
Are You Happy?
When Jewish Wannabes Attack the Bible
Why Jewish Wannabes Attack
The Masters List
You're A Hopeless ....
Preterism Versus Dispensationalism
What's Love Got To Do With It?
When Jewish Wannabes Attack!
Preterism and Calvinism?
Who Do Men Say That I Am?
Signs You Are Doing Something Right
Ivory Tower Theologians and more about me
Satan the Counterfeiter
Saved By Race or By Grace?
Wanna Know Some Secrets?
Distortions of the Resurrection
Apostles Today?
Message and Ministry of Paul compared to the twelve
Maxwell House...Good For Your Desktop
The Feminization of Christianity
Absurd World Views
Religion versus Relationship
The Mysteries Revealed
Replacement Theology
How did the Tribes and Books get Lost?
Catholics, Cliques and Cults
New Age Movement
Should Christians Observe the Sabbath?
The Power of One
Be Thankful
Group Think and the Jew
You Must Be Born Again!!
Tribute to a Friend
Who's That Babe in the Manger: Does it matter
President Bush and the Movie: Unbreakable
Having a Form of Godliness
The Natural Supernatural Connection
Spiritually Challenged Skeptics
Speaking or Praying to the Dead
Eternally Insecure?
The Preterist's False Hope
Apostolic Succession Catholic Style
Predestination or Free Will
The Foolish Confounding the Wise
About Me
Scripture Twisting: Reading into the text
Scripture Twisting: The Figurative Fallacy
So Deep A Child Could Understand
The Apostle Paul
About Us
Requirements For Messiah
Small Groups or the Purpose Driven Church?
Mile High Ministries or Miles Apart Ministries
The Omnipresence and Incarnation of God
Is Jesus the Messiah?
Extrabiblical Nonsense
Blank Page
Is Baptism necessary for Salvation?
Focus on the Family?
Catholicism
Motherhood, Fatherhood or Discipleship?
The Watchtower and Jehovah's Witnesses
Judaism
Reincarnation
Preterism
What is Love
Oneness
That They May Be One
Suffering Servant
Article Page
Interview Page
Reviews Page
Photo Album Page
Mailbag
Contact Me
Archives
New Page Title

.

I wanted to critique the following article to see if it holds water.

Here is the link:

http://www.shoaheducation.com/hyperdispensationalism.html

This article warns us of the warning signs of Hyper Dispensationalism.

I wanted to look at those signs.

Article: "Insistence on 5 [or more ]points of Calvinism."

As far as I know there are only five points of Calvinism:

TULIP

T-otal Depravity

U-nconditional Election

L-imited Atonement

I-rresistable Grace

P-Perseverance of the Saints

I only believe the first and fifth points of Calvinism and its not
because I'm a Dispie or a Calvinist, its because I read the
scripture.

I believed the first and five points before I even knew what a
dispie was.

In fact something is seriously wrong with anyone's theology if they don't believe the first point.

If you don't believe the first point, then you believe that there is
something good in you that helped you come to Christ.

But this quote says, 'Insistence on 5 [or more ]points of Calvinism.'


First of all I dunno of more than these five points and the particular Jews that created this test probably don't even know what these points are.

Article:

"Talk of the Jews having to obey the entirety of the Law to earn
Salvation"

This is allegedly another sign that one is a hyperdispensationalist.

This is not true of the dispensational online book that I sometimes quote from.

They say,

"We have no illusions as to man's utter inability to please God by
works as such in any age. Man has always been saved essentially by the grace of God, through faith. There could be no other way to be saved. This is a fixed principle to which Hebrews 11 bears abundant testimony and it should be self-evident to those who accept as facts the utter depravity of man and the infinite holiness of God.


But this does not alter the fact that God's dealings with men and
the stated terms of acceptance with Him have changed again and again down through the ages and that faith in Him would therefore be expressed in different ways. Hebrews 11 also bears consistent testimony to this fact.

Faith would most assuredly approach God in God's way at any time, and to seek to gain acceptance with Him in any other way would, of course, be unbelief and self-will. Thus, while works never did or could save as such, they did once save as expressions of faith."

http://geocities.com/protestantscot/ttd/ttd_chap1.html

This site is as dispensational as they get, so the test at the top is really the warning signs of those that don't understand
Hyperdispensationalism.

Article goes on:

"Seeing the Jews as Having a Different form of Salvation"

Rather than commenting on this one, I think the previous message dealt with this point as well.

We should be able to agree that there are things said in the bible
that are not applicable to us.

For instance, I should not be concerned about making animal
sacrifices anymore or cutting my beard. (Leviticus 19:27), or
whether my flight is on the sabbath. (Matthew 24:20)

So everything should be judged in light of the whole counsel of God and context.

Take books like James for instance which in the very first verse
say, 'To the twelve tribes scattered abroad.' Now if there wasn't
something to them specifically, what was the purpose of saying that?

"Studying the Bible dispensationally may seem confusing at first but actually it dispels confusion, explains difficult problems,
reconciles seeming contradictions and lends power to the believers ministry.

If I should step inside a modern United States Post Office all would doubtless seem very confusing to me. But it would be a mistake to suggest piling all the mail neatly in one corner and handing it out promiscuously to all corners as some would do with the Bible. The postal employees must "rightly divide" the mail so that each person receives what is addressed to him. What seems like confusion to the novice is really a simplification of the work to be done in getting each person's private mail to him.

It is granted that in the Bible even that which was addressed to
those of other dispensations is given to us for our learning and
profit, but we must not confuse this with our own private mail or
make the mistake of carrying out instructions meant particularly for others.

While I am reading mail addressed personally to me, a friend may hand me, for my interest or information, mail addressed to him. His mail and mine may all prove informative and profitable, but I must still be careful not to confuse the two, expecting to receive things promised to him or carrying out instructions addressed to him.


Thus all the Bible is for us, but it is not all addressed to us or
written about us, and if we would really understand and enjoy it; if we would really know how to use it effectively in service for
Christ, we must be careful always to note who is addressing whom, about what and when and why."


http://geocities.com/protestantscot/ttd/ttd_chap1.html#pref

The Dispie believes that presently there is only one gospel message. (Ephesians 4)

However, the Dispie believes that over a period of time in biblical
history there has been different gospel messages.

Check out my message for more:


http://cuf5.tripod.com/id25.html

"I don't believe that there were many different gospels through
biblical history, I do believe that each successive time the
particular good news was preached, it built on, or got more specific and more closer to the 'whole counsel of God' on the subject.

Prior to Paul they were only contradictory to each other in the
sense that they were incomplete.

The truth is that the good news of the kingdom (Matthew 24:14) that Jesus and Peter preached was only to the Jews and was NOT the 'gospel/good news of the grace of God.' to all. Though it was God's grace, the cross was offered to the JEWS as something to demonstrate their guilt. (Acts 2)


It wasn't until Paul that the mystery was revealed to Jew and
Gentile alike, and that is 'we (Jew and Gentile), are saved by Grace through faith...(Ephesians 2:8), because of the cross."

http://cuf5.tripod.com/id25.html

This site goes on:

"The belief that Jews have NO access to Salvation during this post-Golgotha period."

I don't see anything in what I have studied about Dispensationalism that teaches such a thing.

The closest teaching that I can think of is that in THIS PRESENT
DISPENSATION, the Jew must come to God INDIVIDUALLY not through his group affiliation.

So rather than Group Think:

'...to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.' (Romans 1:16b)

AND

'These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, GO NOT INTO THE WAY OF THE GENTILES, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: 6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. 7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.' (Matthew 10:5 ff)

AND

'(For he that wrought effectually in Peter to the apostleship of the circumcision, the same was mighty in me toward the Gentiles:) 9 And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that WE SHOULD GO TO THE HEATHEN, and THEY UNTO THE CIRCUMCISION.' (Galatians 2),

It is whosoever will, (Acts 10; Romans 3:23,24) and the result is
that presently and spiritually there is no difference. (Acts 15;
Galatians 2).

'And the voice spake unto him again the second time, WHAT GOD HATH CLEANSED, that call not thou common. 16 This was done thrice: and the vessel was received up again into heaven. 17 Now while Peter doubted in himself what this vision which he had seen should mean, behold, the men which were sent from Cornelius had made enquiry for Simon's house, and stood before the gate, 18 And called, and asked whether Simon, which was surnamed Peter, were lodged there.' (Acts 10)

'Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ
UNTO ALL and upon all them THAT BELIEVE: for THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE: 23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;' (Romans 3)

"Belief that the Jews must both believe in the Atonement of Christ AND Obey the whole of the Law during the Tribulation Period in order to be saved."

BJ responds:

I've seen no indication of this from the online and dispensational
book that I quote from.

Still, one has to ask themselves what the purpose of a temple in the future Millenium will be.

It is the dispie that is more consistent in his literal
interpretation in believing that this is a literal temple, not an
allegorical one.

The dispie almost always will believe in the eternal security of the believer.

So when scriptures are used out of context by Catholics etc., such as:

'He that endures to the end shall be saved.' (Matthew 24), it is
the dispie that must add that the context of this is during the
Tribulation/Jacob's Trouble, when the prophetic program for Israel is resumed. (Jeremiah 30:7)

Do In order to Be.

Presently, Those that are saved endure to the end. (Hebrew 6:9;
Philippians 1:6)

Be in order to do.

Reading the book of Revelation does leave one with the impression that during that time it is more works oriented. Not that works ever saved but at different times they were an expression of one's faith as God commanded them to do so.

But, beloved, we are persuaded better things of you, and things that accompany salvation, though we thus speak. (Hebrews 6:9)

The Article Goes on trying to critique Dispensationalism: 

"Beliefs that the Jews do not inherit the Heaven of 'saved' Gentiles but that they instead inherit the Earth." 

BJ Responds: 

Dispies are for the most part silent on the nature of the afterlife,
because scripture isn't real specific in explaining it, except in
describing a New Jerusalem and saying things like:


"But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. 10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God." (1 Corinthians 2)

By his spirit.


"Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure." (1 John 3)

However, one can draw good conclusions based on already established truths.

Some dispies may believe in a merge at the end.

I personally believe that the New Jerusalem will be for those that are Believing and physical Jews.

The body of Christ which consists of believing Jews and Gentiles will be in the 'heavenlies' above.

So believing Jews will have access to both places.

Only believing Jews will have access to the New Jerusalem because it is on earth, is physical, as is the believing Jew and many of the promises made to him. There are still some physical promises that God made to Israel alone.

The promises to the body of Christ are spiritual and in the heavenlies.

"Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ." (Ephesians 1)

If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God. 2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. 3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God. 4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory. (Colossians 3)

Keep in mind that i have always said that this view of the afterlife is an opinion.

Regarding the New Jerusalem

Twelve refers to Israel, One refers to the body of Christ. (Luke
22:30; Ephesians 4)

In the description of the New Jerusalem twelve is used continuously.

Revelation says,

And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever. (Revelation 22)

And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof. (Revelation 21)

Here it says that the Lord God and the Son giveth them light.

Typically where does the light come from?

Heaven

Some argue that if I cannot prove that
Jew and Gentile are sitting in the Son's lap at all times then I am
teaching that they are separated from him and from each other.

What I am saying is that Israel can be in the New Jerusalem and the body of Christ in the heavens above and both still be in the presence of the omnipresent Word of God being warmed by his light.

Coming with Christ to fight does not constitute moving into the New Jerusalem.

Christ is both king and the head of the body.

As King he reigns from New Jerusalem, as the head he reigns at the top of the body (heavens) where a head belongs.

To think that this is impossible is to think that the Omnipresence of God is impossible.

Still with God...

Even Christ stated some things that would be true for Israel and not others. To deny this would be to accept replacement theology which takes the promises from Israel and gives it to the church.

Being spiritual Jews our blessings are in the heavenlies, Jews through and through have blessings in heaven and on earth because they are Jews spiritually and physically.

                                               BJ Max





 


.