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Christianity Under Fire

Is America Cursed?
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Some people have become Ivory Tower politicians. They don't know what to do but they don't like what anyone else has done.

Since Bruce Porteous is starting his mass mailings again, I thought I would represent my critique of one of his past messages and bring attention to some of his beliefs.
 
The following is my critique of his message, 'Is America Cursed?' and some responses from Cynthia and a message about Bruce Porteous' connection to William Branham.
 
Its very revealing that some Christians have been giving a hearty amen to his messages without admitting just how off base he really is in his beliefs.
 
Bruce Porteous is also talking about 'the decline and fall of the Christian Church' which is like Militant Muslims critiquing the United States.
 
The responses are after my original response below.
 
Here it is:
 
--- In Tribulation@yahoogroups.com, Bruce Porteous <bruceporteous50@y...> wrote:
 
*WHY AMERICA IS BEING CURSED?
*
I have just returned from visiting the USA after being in Europe over the last month. What I find in visiting the USA both shocked and alarmed me. I found a nation continuing to sleep-walk towards its own destruction.
 
 The American people have increasingly become "dumbed down" through their media - they are becoming polarized with extremists on both the left and right proclaiming messages of hate and intolerance. Yet the media fails to inform Americans the peril their country is now in - there is a total lack of awareness of the dangers that lie ahead.
 
Bj Responds:
 
Why people want to single out America on this astounds me.
 
No matter what country you are in you will see a public that is being greatly influenced by their media.
 
I believe that the only way one could conclude that America is being polarized by the media is to only look at the extremes.
 
It is easy to look at a lunatic fringe and conclude that everyone in a particular group is like that.
 
People do that all the time. In the movie: Category 7: End of the World, they are representing Christians as Benny Hinn types.
 
Should we conclude that all of Christianity is like Benny Hinn just because he is on the television.
 
Of course not.
 
Usually the ones that are so against Bush are the ones that didn't vote for him and are sore losers or they are against the war in Iraq.
 
The author of this article is from New Zealand, so has to be one of those folks that didn't like us going into Iraq and removing Sadaam Hussein.
 
He must have preferred that Saddaam remain in power.
 
In my opinion, it was Brilliant for Bush to go over there because if the Terrorists are occupied over there....
 
People don't have to agree on this, but usually their intensity of opposition and slander reveals that they have some real anger problems that they need some counsel for.
 
Article goes on:
 
 People fail to grasp on the realities of the economic, political and environmental world which the USA must now co-exist in. There appears to a total lack of leadership or understanding in solving America's or the world's problems.
 
Bj Responds: Why would one critique America and then talk about solving the 'world's problems' unless one is assuming that America is supposed to be solving the world's problems as well as their own?
 
Then when America goes into places like Iraq to solve their problems they complain.
 
If anyone has been influenced by the media it is those that let Late Night Show Hosts influence their view of America and the President.
 
One need only listen to Jay Leno or David  Letterman one evening to see that they are not interested in looking at the facts but making baseless and derogatory jokes about the President of the United States.
 
I am one that believes the war in Iraq was necessary but is not being fought very well.
 
However, I have hope that our President will be victorious before he Leaves.
 
Article goes on:
 
One of the tragedies resulting from the "brain-washing" of the American people is in deceiving them that they are the greatest nation of earth that their way of life is the model all nations should follow. The leadership claims that democracy is the form of governments all nations should adopt.  America is the "land of freedom", yet the majority of American's are under bondage to an economic system that has enslaved them.
 
Bj Responds: So far all I have heard is baseless claims without any evidence. I do think that the U.S. is the model for other nations. If it is true then it is no brag just fact.
 
Obviously, Iraq needs our model after Sadaam, who could deny that?
 
Since when is introducing democracy, which is the freedom to determine ones national destiny a political ideal that is being forced on anyone.
 
Freedom is not imposed on anyone. If they want bondage or despotism then they are free to go back to that.
 
We can say that God is wrong because he gave us the freedom to choose.
 
Of course, some choose evil, but that is what freedom is about.
 
If one is only given the ability to choose good then it is not freedom.
 
If one doesn't have that ability to choose right over wrong then for him it is bondage.
 
One cannot say freedom is wrong because some make the wrong choices, that is silly.
 
This author, to be consistent would have to blame God for giving us a free will.
 
As far as being in bondage to an economic system, my financial reality allows me to minister on the Internet and live comfortably. Doesn't sound like bondage to me.
 
Article goes on:
 
 
Yet many America's continue to deceive themselves into believing that God is blessing America.  While they continue to sing "God Bless America" it is becoming increasingly clear that God is no longer blessing America.  Rather, America is now being cursed because of its sins.
 
Why would God curse America when it still proclaims to be a Christian nation?  Clearly God has blessed America in the past-why should these blessing now withdrawn and the nation be cursed.  The reason why America is being cursed is because of the rejection of the legal code given to us by God through the Bible on how we are to live our lives, and be governed.
 
Bj Responds: Why wouldn't this guy critique all the communist and Muslim countries which follow false Gods and even impose their religion on others?
 
This man, because of freedom of expression has made these statements but then criticises freedom because some make the wrong choices.
 
America is still by far the greatest contributor when disaster's happen in the world but instead of thanking us when we are generous the nations are now complaining that we didn't give more.
 
What hypocrisy to critique one nation for its problems but forget the great good it has and continues to do, while neglecting to critique other nations.
 
Article says:
 
Let's look at some of the reasons how and why America is being cursed today, which will shortly lead to its destruction.
 
    1.  War - the mess America has got itself into in Iraq us a direct result of the nation relying on its own military might and trying to resolve international problems though force, rather than having the faith to trust God to defend them, as He promised if we keep His commandments. It will eventually result in the defeat of the USA, followed by its economic collapse.
 
Bj Responds: This sounds like the majority of detractors that want to critique a particular approach but don't offer an alternative.
 
Some people have become Ivory Tower politicians. They don't know what to do but they don't like what anyone else has done.
 
Then this author presupposes himself to be a prophet that predicts the economic collapse of America. I'm sure the Terrorists are hoping the same thing.
 
Then he critiques America for using force to remove Sadaam Hussein. I'm sure that if we asked him nicely he would have stepped down.
 
Article goes on:
 
  2. Economics - why has what once was the world's richest nation now the world's greatest debtor nation.  America is now totally dependent on being able to attract capital from its former enemies to prevent its economy collapsing.  When America's former enemies are no longer prepared to lend the money to sustain the American economy will be the time its economy will collapse.
 
Bj Responds: America is not totally dependent on former enemies. You need to do your homework.
 
Article says:
 
 3. Environmental - clearly the USA is now suffering the direct
 consequences of the break-down of the global environment. No other nation has squandered its non-renewable resources as America has done. The rejection of environmental laws God has given mankind  has directly resulted in the ecological disaster how planet now faces.  Yet America's leaders continue to live in denial that these problems exist, because the changes needed to be made would not be acceptable economically or politically.  Yet unless these changes are made, natural disasters such as the recent hurricanes will continue to increase.
 
Bj Responds: When someone makes such statements as these you expect some kind of facts to be presented but he offers none. What happened to backing up ones statements?
 
Article states:
 
   4. Law and Order - continued break-down of moral standards and growth in the influence of drugs has resulted in an exploding prison population and growth is most types of crime.  I was shocked to experience people being physically attacked and beaten while in the center of San Francisco in broad daylight when visiting this city.
 
BJ Responds: San Francisco, is truly a decadent city but have you ever been to Amsterdam?
 
Both Are Liberal And San Francisco, Wants Independence From America.
 
I have been to Amsterdam and they don't believe they have a drug problem because they have declared them legal.
 
When going to Amsterdam, I was confronted by many drug pushers while walking the city. Amsterdam has a street that folks can walk and see Prostitutes legally and in windows presenting their wares. I have never seen such frightening looking women in my life.
 
Sin isn't restricted to America, it is worldwide. Maybe you need to go to places other than America to see this.
 
Article states:
 
   5. Care for the needy - I was amazed to see the numbers of homeless living on the streets in the USA.  For a nation that has so much wealth, it is a shock to see so many poor people begging in the streets. This one does not see in Europe or New Zealand. There is something wrong with a society that does not provide care for those less fortunate.
 
Bj Responds: I ran a food bank and a Christian coffeehouse for about fifteen years in the inner city and encountered many street people and the majority of them wanted to live on the street, so if they fooled you into thinking that they were not being cared for you maybe you should have looked deeper.
 
Article states:
 
   6. Divisions within American society - the opposition to the Iraqi War is now gaining moment, with public demonstrations against the occupation of Iraq throughout the USA.  Unfortunately, the American people were lied to by their leaders, supported by the populist media (such as Fox News) and the Christian-right into supporting the invasion of Iraq in 2003.  They have now are coming to realize how they were deceived.  To withdraw the American forces from Iraq now would be an even worse disaster for the country than the illegal invasion was in the first place.
 
BJ Responds: President Bush was reelected to office even when we knew the facts about the Iraq war. What people are now objecting to is the way the war is being fought.
 
Your article is so biased it is easy to critique. To say that it is illegal to invade a country where a dictator is murdering it's citizens is like saying, we ought to leave this Hitler alone and maybe he will stop doing what he is doing.
 
Article states:
 
   7. Cost of living - as inflation increases, and real incomes
      declined, many people are now struggling to exist. Increasing
      interest rates placing additional burdens of the American consumer and industry.  The standard of living will steadily decline as the  national and consumer debts grow - a greater percentage of income is being required to service these debts, reducing disposable income.  Taxation will continue to increase as the governments  struggle with increasing domestic and military expenditure.
 
Bj Responds: Cost of Living increases are probably a reality even in New Zealand.
 
The protesters in South America are rioting and destroying people's property there because America is well to do, and at the encouragement of Chavez, a communist leader.
 
The whole argument is 'you are poor because America is rich', So what is it?, is America rich or poor?
 
Article states:
 
   8. America's ability to defend itself - the War against Terrorism has placed a considerable burden on the domestic economy, with little to show for it.  For a visitor to the USA today one feels like one is entering the Soviet Union in the days of the Cold War. While Homeland Security is costing the American taxpayer billions of dollars, the military is being starved of resources for the equipment required to defend America.
 
Bj Responds: This is the argument of one that lets one defend him or her then complains that their defender is getting tired.
 
Article states:
 
 
   9. The destruction of America's production base.  America became great through exporting its goods, technology and services to the world.  This ability of America to produce and exportcompetitively is being under-mined, as more resources are being diverted into defense and the military.  While Japan and Germany (both high-cost producing countries) continue to competitivelyincrease their exports, American industry is no longer able compete internationally.
 
Bj Responds: Says Who, You?
 
I find it interesting that a search to find out whether this author is even qualified or has even done his homework on such things reveals nothing.  However, he at one time was a member of my group and had some really peculiar religious beliefs.
 
Article states:
 
  10. The health of Americans - anyone visiting the USA is amazed with the number of over-weight people.  Clearly something is wrong with the American diet.  Maybe it is the hormones used in producing meat that is partly responsible.  Where you have a society driven by greed, producing food for maximum profit, regardless of the  consequences to the consumer, the result are a people often eating themselves to death, always lusting for more, and never satisfied.
 
Bj Responds: Is it me or does this guy sound like he came into this country with a chip already on his shoulder. Unless you present an actual study, we can only assume that you are using selective criticisms that only present a unbalanced picture.
 
Article states:
 

The decline and coming collapse of the American Empire will be sudden
and dramatic.  It will reduce the USA to a land of poverty - its people will face horrendous tribulation.  There will be total economic collapse. Money will become worthless.  There will be a complete break-down in law and order - anarchy will reign.  There will be wide-spread famine and disaster. Millions will die.  What was once the richest country in the world will soon become the poorest nation in the world?
 
Now Bruce claims to be a prophet, whether the US faces such tribulation will be based on what the world as a whole experiences.
 
BJ Maxwell 11/11/2005
Revised 2/27/2007
 

I also point out Bruces connection to William Branham, a heretic.

That message is entitled: Birds of a feather promote all kinds of error together:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Tribulation/message/607

Also

 

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Tribulation/message/606

Cynthia makes some insightful responses at:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Tribulation/message/601

AND

My response to her:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Tribulation/message/605

The William Branham Bruce Porteous Connection:

""In 1957 Brother Branham said, "America doesn't want the Gospel, (You know that); we just might as well admit that. This Anglo-Saxon people is finished; that's all. There's no more Gospel that America will receive. Oh, you get a few stragglings now and then; but just as the Gospel, it's over. And you can't even preach to them, can't talk to them. They won't believe nothing. See? They just got their own hardheaded ideas, and they're set, and the next thing for this nation is judgment. She's going to have it too. It may be through depression; it may be through an atomic bomb; it may be through a great plague, a disease or something; but she's ready. It's a-coming; thousands times thousands will fall" (Hebrews, p. 87.4).

Brother Branham said, "When God sends forth a message and tells the people, and they don't receive it, He then withdraws His servant and sends His plagues: famine, death, spiritually speaking, physically also. You watch for a depression, brother. You think you've seen something; you just wait after while. You haven't seen nothing. You think you're dying for a good spiritual revival; you wait till after a bit. You just wait, long and cry to hear the Word of God. The Bible said so. "There'll be a famine in the last days," said the prophet, "and not for bread and water alone, but for hearing the true Word of God." But that Voice will be quiet in the wilderness somewhere, hid away" (Jezebel Religion, p. 22:100). " Bruce Porteous

http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/nl322.htm

"Bruce Porteous" AND "William Branham" Google Search:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22Bruce+Porteous%22+AND+%22William+Branham%22

Who Is William Branham:

http://www.letusreason.org/Latrain4.htm

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